Me and my brother have been brewing for a few months now. We're currently fermenting our sixth batch. Our first was great, it was an imperial ipa recipe we got from our local homebrew store. We brewed that in the winter and fermented at very stable temperatures. All of our batches since have gone off without a hitch... until we got to drinking the beer. There is a sweet, syrupy, flavor in the beers(and the actual "beer flavor is detectable but disapears quickly). Its not undrinkable, its just not supposed to be there. We did another IPA and it had that flavor, then an Imperial Stout same thing, I just cracked a honey wheat we brewed (albeit a little early not quite fully carbonated yet) and voila there is that same crappy taste. At first I thought maybe it was that "green" taste I've heard so much about and have stopped drinking the stout and am resigned to let it sit in the bottles a few more weeks I wish I could describe the flavor a little more. The first batch was brewed at my folks place and fermented in their basement at a fairly constant temp in the mid to high sixties, the following batches were brewed at my apt and fermented in my closet with very unstable temps. The philadelphia area has been getting very drastic temp fluctuations and its tough to keep up with. Could high/and or unstable fermentation temps be the cause. In addition to that our primary fermenter is the same plastic bucket my dad used to brew his when I was just a little tyke. I suppose I should replace that. I don't think its sanitation as our procedure is pretty tight. I'm extremely frustrated because I am obsessed with homebrewing, and beer in general, I have been reading everything possible and on the internet constantly sucking up info, I refuse to give up but would like to really enjoy and share some really good homebrew.

I've never experienced what you describe, but to me there is a distinct difference between brews made from extract and brews made from all-grain recipes. At least that's the case with what's made in my garage. You may also be right about starting with a new primary fermentor. If you're not using all-grain recipes you should give it a try. It's more fun and the ales are much better. I'm a big fan of Sierra Nevada Pale Ale so I brew a lot of High Sierra Pale Ale all-grain recipes from HomeBrew.com. I recently started purchasing bulk quantities of grains due to the demand made on my kegged ales.
Good luck, and don't give up.

Thanks. I'm planning on moving on to all-grain as soon as I can afford the initial cost of extra equipment, but i'd like to get some good brews from extract first. I've heard that all-grain tends to produce a better product. On the other hand I've had some beers that a friend of mine brewed from extract and they were excellent so I feel it can be done. Either way I appreciate the feedback and suppose i will just keep on truckin.

If you could try to describe the flavor you're getting a little better, that might help. Try letting a few of your buddies taste it, and see what kinda comments you get.

I know you don't think sanitation is a problem, and its quite possible that it isn't, but old plastic is very difficult to sanitize well. It tends to get very small scratches in it that harbor bacteria very well. Do yourself a favor and switch to either a new plastic bucket, or a glass carboy. Even if you're not having problems with sanitizing that bucket now, I believe that eventually you will, given it's age.

Fermentation temps play a very big role in the taste of your finished beer. Do you think you've exceeded the temperature range of the yeast? (Ale yeast typically run best around 65 to 75 degrees F. YMMV depending on yeast strain.) I've had a few batches turn out very cidery (wine-like) from fermenting too high. These had a very faint beer flavor, but were mostly wine-ish.


What yeast have you been using? Did the beer taste bad immediately after fermentation, or did the flavor only occur after bottling? What method did you use to sanitize the bottles? Did you make sure to sanitize the caps as well?

I've got more questions than answers for you, but answering all of these questions might help to narrow down a problem. I'm quite certain that brewing with extract is not the cause of your problems (unless your extract is as old as that fermenting bucket! ).

Cheers,
Dave

Tallbrosbrewing wrote:...There is a sweet, syrupy, flavor in the beers...

It might be something as simple as that it hasn't fermented out completely. The booklets that come with extract cans say some ridiculous things such as (1) your brew will be ready to bottle after a week, (2) if your going to transfer to a secondary do it after three days or as soon as the Krausen drops, (3) leave for two weeks after bottling before drinking it. In my experience (others have had different experiences) with extract recipes the brew should be left for 10-14 days in the primary and up to 3 weeks in the secondary. Depending on the beer style the bottle conditioning might take 1-4 months, or at least 3 weeks to carbonate at minimum. Thats a total of time at least four times as long as often recommended. I once used a can of liquid stuff called 'brewers sugar' that made the brew syrupy, but in the cases I've had if its sweet it needs longer in the bottle.

Don't give up!!

Joseph and Dave have very good questions and points. When brewing in the warmer months I use the old wet towel and fan method for keeping my fermentors below 75 degrees. I've had very good luck with the recipes I use most by leaving the batch in the primary for one week or less, and in the secondary for two to three weeks. After bottling I did a taste test after two weeks, but the brew seemed to be much better after at least three weeks in the bottle. I guess we're assuming that you use corn sugars in your batches and when you bottle.....

Thanks for all the input, its a huge help. The extract is new, and the hydrometer readings show that the beer is fully fermented. I've committed to going with a new primary fermenter. I will also be aquiring an old refrigerator out of my friends parents garage that they no longer use. I'll install a thermostat and use that for fermentation and maybe even lagering . And i'm going to re-evaluate our sanitation routine and hopefully improve it. I'm fairly certain that given all the info that the drastic temp variation is to blame(ambient temps in my apt reached 80 before I panicked and installed the air conditioner in april, about two months earlier than i usually do). The taste is wine-like or cidery, which from what i've been reading can be attributed to too high fermentation temps. Either way I'm going to replace that old bucket. Again thanks for the input

Sounds like you've nailed down the problem! If bad temperature control was the problem, you'll likely be tossing out the beer you've already bottled. In my experience, that wine flavor will not go away with time. In fact, it seems to get more pronounced after carbonating. Blech! Life's too short to drink bad beer!

Cheers,
Dave

Don't toss it! Even if aging makes it worse give the beer a chance on it's own terms.

Both times I've made a gruit they've had a sour bite to them. When it first happened I blamed it on infection (which it was), but after brewing a few other beers succesfully and then having my second gruit go the same way I started blaming everything, fermentation temp, oxidation. If I could blame it for both beers going bad I did. Finally I took a beer in from the first batch that I'd been aging into the local brew shop. The guy who runs the shop happens to be an award winning lambic brewer, and when he tried it the first thing he said was that intentianally or not I'd made a lambic, and not a bad one at that. Keep in mind that only these two beers had done this, and I didn't change my process for any of my beers.

Anyway,

I gave the beer a chance, and even though I'm not crazy about lambics I've developed a taste for this beer. Considering I still have like 20 bottles from my first batch left says something about the drinkability, but I like the beer, and I enjoy it. All that to say a bad beer is a bad beer, but just because it didn't work the way you wanted doesn't make it bad. Can I get an Amen?

Amen Brother!

Expectations play a HUGE role in how we perceive and enjoy things. If you bite into an apple and it tasted like bacon you'd probably gag...but bacon tastes good. Except it for what it is and enjoy.

Oh i'm not gonna toss it. Its not undrinkable, just not very good. It might be tough, but I think me and my brother can take care of proper disposal

I think it would have looked a bit scary if it was from bad sanitisation.
Extract can make great beers if done right too.
I always ferment 2 weeks in a primary. Then i bottle it and let it sit for 2 or 3 weeks.
I think everybody is right about the temp being too high.
Mix some v-8 juice and tobasco and they will be drinkable.

Keep in mind that fermenting causes heat. So your wort can be about 10 degrees warmer than the air temp around it.
That will make for some really funky tasting beer. Keep light off it also.

I have an old 3 keg commercial kegerator i keep my fermenters in. In the summer i put 1 gallon frozen jugs in the fridge to keep it cool(fridge does not work). I just swap them out every day.
Sounds like your next batch should be better.
Was it all extract in the recipe?

I noticed a sweeter taste to my beer after I started using Carbonation Drops at bottling time. The sweetness went away after letting the bottles sit for another two weeks. After that, I did not notice any different changes in the taste of the beer.

The recipe was extract w/specialty grains. Now the cidery flavor has diminished but there is a strong taste reminiscent of rubbing alchohol. Not so tasty. I got the fridge, which is good cuz i hate running the air conditioner nonstop when i don't need to. Again, thanks for all the input.

I'm no beer expert. I do mostly wine. However I had the same problem with warm temps in the summer. I have a small room off my shop. I mounted a cheapo $100 Walmart air conditioner in the wall facing out into the shop. You have to modify the wall slightly to accomodate a window air conditioner but they work and are pretty cheap to run for a small area. I try to keep my room at least down to 70 in the summer.